Unfold: Stimulator Jones

Low Budget Environments, a record born out of Stimulator Jones' lifelong love of hip-hop is set for release 16th July. It sees the singer and multi-instrumentalist compiling the hip-hop beats he's been creating since getting his first sampler as a teenager. The album exhibits his no-nonsense approach to beat making and amalgamates into the stand out instrumental Hip-hop album of the year so far. Neil Housego caught up with him recently to discuss esoteric samplers, obscene record collections and the power of trial and error.

Sam Jones Lunsford AKA Stimulator Jones reclines at the left-hand side of the Zoom frame. His presence is instantly accomodating, energetic and keen. Wearing a black vest with a wooden toothpick at rest in the corner of his mouth, his surroundings are domestic with a piece of audio equipment intersecting the bottom of the frame, hinting at the home studio beyond the edges. Our conversation evolves at a leisurely pace.

The album has a really authentic sound and reminds me of a Dilla production in the most fundamental sense. How did this album come together?

Basically, I had a collection of beats that I have been making since 1998, when I got my first sampler. I had discussed with Peanut Butter Wolf the idea of putting out a sort of anthology of my best hip hop beats, and so I went through my archives, picked what I thought were the best ones, and sent those over for his thoughts and opinions. We selected it down to a tracklist for the album, and it really consists of a collection of beats that I've made over the years. The oldest one on the album is actually from 2004. It goes all the way up to 2020 and includes all the years in between.

That's surprising as it has a really homogenous sound. I mean, you wouldn't think it would have that much time between the pieces. Yeah, it's cool that we were able to make it work as a whole.

When did you first meet Peanut Butter Wolf?

I met him in 2015, but I've been a fan of Stones Throw and his music since '98, '99.

I'm assuming Madlib and Dilla have been massive influences?

Big time. Big time. Yeah, I've been a huge fan of them since I was a teenager. When I became a beatmaker and a producer, I was definitely listening to Lootpack and Peanut Butter Wolf and all of MadLib's different projects. They're such a big inspiration to me.

Are you a committed crate digger like those guys? Is that a part of your process? I'm hearing a lot of 70's and 80's soul music samples in your work.

Yeah, that's definitely where I get a lot of inspiration because that was the whole thing when I started making beats. You had to go out and find records that had cool sounds and loops. I've been collecting records since I was a kid, but my collection is not that big, it's definitely nothing like MadLib's or Peanut Butter Wolfs (laughs), but it's such a big part of what I enjoy. I love going through old music, finding something that I can take and rework into something that's my own. Putting a creative touch on it, that's a fun process for me; taking a sound that already exists and then putting it in a new context to create something new is exciting.

How does being a multi-instrumentalist fit into that more sample-based process?

I like to have that feeling of sample-based things instead of live instrumentation because it can be challenging to mix those two things and make that work. If I'm doing sample-based productions, I generally don't put a lot of live instrumentation. I sometimes do, but just using samples is almost like limiting yourself, and within those limits, you have to use your creativity.

And also with samples, you get that baked in vibe as well as what hardware/ software you're putting it through? I saw you using the Yamaha SU700. That seems to be your weapon of choice. Is that right?

Yeah, that's been my main making machine for years. I've used the Roland SP404, 303 and even the 202 in the past too, and I also had an Ensoniq ASR-10 for a while. But the SU700 is my main machine for sure.

There seems to be a whole movement around the SP404! But I like that the SU700 has remained under the radar all these years. You've obviously got to know that machine very well, and that's the critical part, isn't it?

I've used it for countless tracks, so, yeah, I've got very intimate with the machine! (laughs)

I suppose the key isn't about chasing a different piece of hardware for a particular sound but more about knowing your gear inside and out. So have you had access to the legendary Stones Throw record collection since joining the label?

I've been to Wolf's house, and his collection is insane!

He didn't let you borrow any pieces then!?!

No! He had this whole room, and both walls were full from floor to ceiling.

Lot's of 7 inches too right?

Oh yeah, yeah. It's out of control, man. (laughs) I don't quite have that much room in my house!

Are you using vinyl exclusively for your samples, or do you use YouTube, as many other producers do nowadays?

I stick with records and stuff for the most part. I'll use cassettes or CDs or even VHS tapes sometimes. But yeah, I try to stick to vinyl as it has the best sound quality to me. I often raid the dollar bin, though. I generally don't drop a bunch of money for sample material.

The thrill of that whole process, the search in charity shops and bargain bins to find that tiny sample that nobody has used?

Yeah, exactly. That's definitely a big part of the whole process. To find something that may be considered trash to someone else, you take it and make it useful.

Sounds like the energy of that process feeds your work too? It's so easy to jump on Youtube and find an old Northern Soul seven inch that you couldn't get 20 years ago because only two people in the world owned them. But then the sample becomes a little bit more dead because it's now from Youtube rather than from a piece of wax.

I agree, and that kind of takes the fun out of it for me because, at that point, it becomes too easy, you know what I mean? I like the challenge and the roll of the dice, that random factor. Like when you go digging, you don't know what you're going to get it, and you're like, 'I don't know what this is, I don't know what's on it'. And then you get home and discover something cool on there, which can be a fantastic feeling. You don't get that surfing the web.

I suppose when we search for anything on the internet, we're driving the process. The nature of it means you have to make decisions on what you're actually looking for. But when you're at that bargain bin, all that premeditated thought is taken out of the equation, and then you're having to create with the ingredients you're given. I love that approach, but how do you manage that in terms of clearing the samples?

I let the label handle that stuff. I'll tell them what I've sampled, but generally, I'll try to take things that aren't well known or take tiny pieces and rearrange them in a way that's not recognizable.

I agree that if you're grabbing whole loops, the artists need to be paid, but on the other hand, I think that a fair use mentality should be employed when people are respecting the art of collage and building new forms. Whereabouts do you like to create?

I'm in Roanoke, Virginia. It's kind of in a small town in the mountains and the countryside. It's not like super country, but relatively small. I'm born and raised here and still live here. I've travelled around a lot, but I reside here because it's cheap to live and I can create in peace. I've got a studio in my house, and I have another recording studio that I share with some of my friends. Travelling to play live isn't an issue.

Have you been booked for many gigs after these difficult Pandemic times?

I'm starting to, you know, last year obviously was a bust. But yeah, I'm starting to get offers for things again. It's great that things are starting to pick up again.

How do you translate your music into a live situation?

I have different setups for different gigs. Sometimes I will use a sampler and turntable or two turntables with Serato. Sometimes I do stuff where I sing as well. And sometimes I'll just have like a backing track running off my laptop, and I'll sing over that, and occasionally play some instruments, like guitar, keyboards or drums. It kind of depends. If it's a beat set or a DJ set or a vocal performance set. I'm capable of doing different types of performances. With these album tracks, I may do a DJ set, blending the beats with some scratching.

Do you find it valuable to have somewhere quiet to retreat to when you want to create?

Definitely, because, you know, if I lived in a city like New York or Los Angeles, it would be difficult to afford a recording studio or, you know, a place where you could get really loud, that's important.

Growing up in a more rural setting, what was your route into the hip-hop scene?

I remember hearing it on the radio when I was real little. I was born in '85, so it was kind of always there. I can remember in '89 on the radio hearing Young MC's 'Bust a Move', Tone Loc and stuff like that. I liked it a lot, and I would tape it on cassette from the radio. As the 90s progressed, I got into the alternative stuff like Nirvana and all that. And then through that, I got into punk, Ska Punk and Third Wave Ska. But then I also heard hip-hop stuff on the radio and on TV and from the older kids who'd be like, 'Check out this Easy-E tape!' which was really crazy. When I went to middle school in '96, I was going to school with more inner-city kids, and they were way more in touch with Hip-hop music so I started checking it out more, and it just hit me what a cool art form it was. I became obsessed with it at that point. So yeah, '96, that was like Outcast' ATliens', Ghostface Killer 'Ironman'. All this like mind-blowing music was coming out, and I would watch Rap City on BET. They were showing all these music videos of all this stuff, and it was amazing. And then by '97, I was like trying to scratch on hand me down turntables at my parent's house!

Yeah, Belt drive turntables!

Yeah (laughs). But then my uncle gave us this big old RCA Victor. Like a big wooden cabinet with the radio and the turntable down inside it. And it had a powerful motor. I guess it was a direct drive motor. So I learned to scratch on that thing, actually. Then I started to slowly figure out how the music was made. I would just look at the liner notes on CDs and stuff, you know, it would say that it contained a sample from this and that, so I was like, 'I want to sample, I wanna sampler'. I would read, they sampled this Led Zeppelin drumbeat, or they sampled this Funkadelic track, and my dad had a bunch of records. So I realized the next step was to get a sampler. Christmas of 1998, I got a little Yamaha SU20.

It sounds like figuring all this out by yourself gave you a lot of ownership of the process. You see so many Youtube tutorials and stuff, but that can never go in your bloodstream in the way you just described. That's my belief anyway because with those tutorials the viewer is engaging from a distance rather than getting their hands dirty so to speak.

Yeah, back then, there was no Youtube, and the only way to figure it out was to kind of dive in. And fortunately, I had an older brother who was very helpful because he's also a musician, and he would mess with the sampler and give me pointers and tips. He was a guiding light for me, especially on technical things. I was still really young at the time, I was like, 12 or 13, and none of my friends were into this stuff, so I didn't have anybody that I could go to and be like, hey, show me how to DJ or show me how to make beats or whatever. I just had to listen to the albums and even watch what they were doing in the music videos that I would catch on TV. The rest was trial and error.

Important that you weren't just listening to Hip-hop exclusively too?

I'm a lover of all music, and that's how my parents raised me. My dad's record collection was all over the place with Rock, Funk, Blues and Reggae, all kinds of stuff, man. And so that's the kind of environment I was raised in, and that's how I came to understand that there's good music everywhere! Why box yourself in?

I'm of the same mindset totally. As a kid, it could have been The Beatles, through to Jazz, through to Classical. So did you have a musical upbringing in the traditional sense, you know, structured piano lessons and all that?

I do come from a musical family. My mom plays the piano very well and sings, and she was active in the church choir and stuff. And then my dad, he plays a bit of guitar and saxophone, and he would just kind of mess around. Both huge, huge lovers of music. My dad had a big record and CD collection, and he was always listening to different things on the stereo. Also, my brother got a drum set when he was like four years old or something, and he just naturally picked it up and then solidified that with drum lessons. I would mess around with the drums and mess around on the piano and eventually, the guitar, and I taught myself from watching them. They'd show me bits and pieces, so I would take these little snippets of technique and mess with it independently. This was happening alongside listening to tons of music, listening deeply with my ear and trying to process that. How are they playing that? Let me try it, and oh, okay, I think this is what they're doing, you know, that kind of thing?

Like the old jazz guys listening at gigs and trying out licks and building their chops. I think it's a kind of a lost art to really listen deeply. It's a lost art because there's so much music available nowadays. People move on so quickly. As a listener and music lover, how do you contend with the amount of content out there?

It's quite overwhelming, and it's all right at our fingertips. I use Spotify, but I have mixed feelings about streaming services like that. They are useful, and I do use them, but there are a lot of things I don't like about them. I don't agree with a lot of their business practices, and the sound quality is not great. However, I do discover music with them, but I still listen to records too. I'm always finding old music that I've never heard. I mean, that's just an endless pool to swim in! There are obviously lots of great new artists, and I'll rely on recommendations from people; they'll be like, 'Check this out', or they'll post something on their social media.

Do you feel like you can enjoy new music without it interfering with your own music? Do you find yourself being influenced directly, or do you try and maintain a distance?

I'm flexible in that sense that I do hear new things and, and I'll be inspired by that but not where I'll be copying or whatever. I might take a little idea or a little piece of something, or it'll give me an idea for a certain kind of mood or texture. It may be a bit of a cliche to say this, but I really try to compete with myself when I'm producing. It's personal expression at the end of the day; all I'm trying to do is express myself the way I know how and hopefully people can connect with that through my music.

Great to have that exposure through Stones Throw. How did that connection come about?

I was making music and putting it on Soundcloud and Bandcamp, slowly building a following when Sofie Fatouretchi, who was working for the label, somehow heard my music and contacted me towards the end of 2015. She was putting together a compilation and asked if I wanted to contribute some music, and so I immediately said yes and sent her a folder of a bunch of different tracks. I had some that were just instrumentals, and some had vocals, and they chose one of my songs that had vocals. That was 'Soon Never Comes Okay', which is my most popular track. And I think on the strength of that track Chris (Peanut Butter Wolf) got interested, and he emailed me and asked if I would be down to work on some other stuff in the future. So then we spoke on the phone and then eventually went out to L.A. We all just hit it off, and it's been an amazing journey so far!

Low Budget Environments Striving for Perfection by Stimulator Jones is released July 16th on Stones Throw Records